Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma

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is 5SR9E a valid TWP?

Christopher Tiffany Christopher Tiffany

posted on December 13, 2013

Hi my great grandfather is Thomas Ray Payne a son of James Buchannan Payne ,a son of Benjamin Franklin Payne.

How do I confirm if the number above is valid before I go trhough the trouble of obtaining certified birth/death certificates in order to get a CDIB?

On your website it says if the#contains MCR it will not be possible, and I want to make sure it is not a typo on the record I have and waste everyone’s time.

The information was obtained from a microfilm at Dallas Public Library. If necessary, I can scan and attach the record.

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on December 13, 2013

township 5 south range 9 east. this is what 5SR9E is. this is a location on a map. each township has 36 sections. each section is one mile by one mile, containing 640 acres.

but i don’t see the relationship between that and tribal membership.

you apparently have an image of some kind but you don’t describe what it is.

oklahoma became a state in 1907. before that it was known as indian territory, and there were five subdivisions of that: one was choctaw nation. this is a location in the indian territory. forts administered government services.

5SR9E is not an enrollment # or a family group.

people usually use an index to search for a direct ancestor and get the card#/family group and an enrollment #.
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/choctaw-indian-research.htm
scroll down to choctaw indian rolls:
Search the Final Rolls~ Data Base
and click that link. put in your direct ancestor’s name and i think partial names are ok.
if you find someone who might be an ancestor, click on the # in the card column to see the family group.
this family group should match with your family in the 1900 census.
see the Guide to Using the Final Rolls
to understand the codes on the records. p=parent, iw=intermarried white (a general nontribal description), bb-by blood.

if your family is on the dawes roll as MCR, this means mississippi choctaw refused. a few of these people were enrolled by tribal adoption, by legal proceedings but most were not.

you should find your family 1900-1940 in the census, so that you know names, dates, locations. having this information, it will be easier to find your family.

if you have a card#, know the family members in your family group, then look at the enrolled members of the tribe.
http://www.okhistory.org/research/dawes
find your relative here, if they were enrolled. this will give you an enrollment #. if your family was not enrolled, then they will not be on this link.

look on the 1910 census and find your family. if your family was renting, then they were not enrolled and given an allotment of land.

if they are on the 1900 census, were they on the indian population schedule or were they listed on the federal schedule. if they were on the federal schedule, this means that they were living in a majority non-native area. if they were found on the indian population schedule, they were living in an area where the majority were natives.

if your family was not living in oklahoma by 1900, they probably didn’t apply to one of the five major tribes of oklahoma. if your family lived elsewhere, you should use the location to find a tribe nearby and see if they applied for enrollment. the idea of the reservation is that natives had to agree to live under the authority of a tribe when they enrolled.

some people did not want to live under the authority of a tribe. some people were philosophically opposed to tribal membership. some people didn’t qualify for enrollment in a tribe.

there are 63 tribes in oklahoma, not just the five major tribes.

tribal heritage and tribal enrollment are two different topics.

genealogists use names, dates, locations, children and spouses to match records. if you have a common surname, you need to give more information rather than less. if you post about women, it is helpful to include the maiden name and the married name and designate which one is the maiden name.

start with what you know, gather documentation, then you can go backward in time. so get your birth certificate, your parents’ birth certificates and marriage license and then you can start on your grandparents. if someone passed away after 1/1/1937, they probably have a social security application on file. if you ask a government agency for a birth certificate, and they were born before 1929, they might have submitted a delayed birth certificate. death certificates, cemetery information and obituaries are helpful. you can usually get a copy of an obituary, newspaper mentions such as birth of a child or marriage, through the interlibrary loan program – see your local public library for this. i usually start with the death and work toward the person’s birth. military records and pension records can be helpful. census records can tell you where they were at particular times, names of family members. the census records up to 1940 are available, although the 1890 census was largely destroyed.

you will need to know who the family members were 1830-1930 or so, where they were located. a good way to do this is by census records.
the first time period to concentrate on is 1900-1930 because most tribes enrolled during this period.
federal census records can help you here. you can get access through your local public library – two databases: 1) heritage quest, 2) ancestry.com.

the dawes roll shows the applicants to the five major tribes 1896-1906 in indian territory/oklahoma. if your family applied for this, there would be a census card, dawes application, other supporting documents and testimony. these are located at NARA
http://www.archives.gov
try the fort worth, TX office.
there are 63 tribes in oklahoma but only the 5 major tribes list applicants on the dawes roll taken 1896-1906 in indian territory/oklahoma.

requirements for enrollment for several oklahoma tribes:
http://thorpe.ou.edu/OILS/blood.html
What are tribal membership requirements?

Tribal enrollment criteria are set forth in tribal constitutions, articles of incorporation or ordinances. The criterion varies from tribe to tribe, so uniform membership requirements do not exist.

Two common requirements for membership are lineal decendency from someone named on the tribe’s base roll or relationship to a tribal member who descended from someone named on the base roll. (A “base roll” is the original list of members as designated in a tribal constitution or other document specifying enrollment criteria.) Other conditions such as tribal blood quantum, tribal residency, or continued contact with the tribe are common.

http://www.narf.org/nill/resources/enrollment.htm

enrollment is a two step process. first you have to get your CDIB card from the BIA to show your degree of blood/eligibility to enroll in a particular tribe, and then you have to apply to the tribe for acceptance, if you meet their membership requirements.

Tribal Government personnel, usually an Enrollment Clerk, located at a regional or agency office processes applications for Certificates of Degree of Indian Blood (CDIB) and Indian Preference in Employment, BIA Form 4432, to anyone who can provide documentation that he or she descends from an American Indian tribe.
http://www.bia.gov/WhatWeDo/ServiceOverview/TribalGov/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_American_recognition_in_the_United_States
this article has many resources.
however i find the paragraph on “Recognition for individuals” to be somewhat insensitive.

i think someone should rewrite that paragraph.

What are the most typical requirements for membership?
Each tribe has a base roll which was established, usually, in the early 20th century, listing the members of the tribe
at that time. Your first challenge will be to prove direct lineal descent from someone listed on that base roll. Then
you must prove that you have the required level of blood quantum – the percentage of your genetic make-up that
is native by bloodline. Most tribes require a 1/4 blood quantum – that is, you must be at least one-fourth Native
American – but note that the Eastern Band of the Cherokees requires that you be only 1/16 or higher to join, and the Cherokee Nation has no minimum quantum restriction, so long as you can prove descent. There may be other conditions for membership as well: requirements for tribal residency or continued contact with the tribe are common.
http://freedomcenter.org/_media/pdf/genealogy/16.%20Native%20American%20-%20Tribal%20Membership.pdf

choctaw enrollment, forms, FAQs
http://www.choctawnation.com/services/departments/enrollment-cdib-and-tribal-membership/

obituaries through the oklahoma choctaw tribe is through the history link for the tribe:
http://www.choctawnation.com/history/

social security application for a deceased person:
http://www.ssa.gov/foia/html/foia_guide.htm
form SS-5.

your public library probably has a subscription to heritage quest and ancestry.com. fold3.com is another useful database for native records and military records, but they are a subscription. however, many times, their month’s subscription price is less than the price of a dawes packet. you can google fold3 and your ancestor’s name to see if your relative’s dawes packet is available at fold3.
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/final-rolls.htm

http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/choctaw-indian-research.htm
access genealogy’s collection of information
if you are from another tribe, use the links at the right.
if you are from an associated tribe, see the several possible links on the webpage.

bear in mind that many records are not online. always collect documents, as just the reference to a relative in an index informs you that a document is available.

death records:
death certificate: state vital records or if very old, state archives. ask for the person’s name at the time of death. you can look at death indices, such as the social security death index 1964-present for a date of death on rootsweb.com or ancestry.com.
obituary: see your local public library, interlibrary loan program. ask for the person’s name at the time of death. approximate date of death is helpful. if old, state historical society or state archives might have historical newspapers.
cemetery record: try findagrave.com or interment.net. ask for the person’s name at the time of death. if you find a relative, you can click on the county or cemetery to see if others with the same surname are buried there.

marriage records:
state vital records office, county clerk or if old, state archives or state historical society.

birth records:
state vital records office, or if old, state archives or state historical society. if the birth was before 1940, ask for a birth certificate or a delayed birth certificate. many people had to get delayed birth certificates when social security came into effect because they had to show proof of age. this will be under the name used at the time of birth.

census records:
you will want to search for census records 1940 on down to the birth of your relative. the federal census was taken every 10 years, however the 1890 census was largely destroyed by fire. there are also some state census records and native census records and native rolls. ancestry.com and heritage quest are two databases that include many census records. many native census records kept by NARA (http://www.archives.gov) are transcribed at accessgenealogy.

first of all, heritage and tribal enrollment are two different things. many times natives didn’t apply for enrollment because 1) they didn’t qualify, 2) they were philosophically opposed to enrollment, 3) they didn’t have documentation, or 4) they were mississippi choctaw and their ancestor had accepted land or benefits in lieu of tribal enrollment. some mississippi choctaw were accepted by adoption or lawsuit.

for those people who do not yet have a card, you should research the 1900-1940 census to know approximate dates of birth, birthplaces, family members. this will also tell you if someone is more likely to be on the freedman roll or as applicants to the dawes roll taken 1896-1906 in indian territory/oklahoma for the five major tribes.

applicants on the dawes roll can be found here:
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/finalroll.php
partial names are ok. look at the guide link for explanation of the codes.

when you find a possible name, then click on the card# in the card column to see the family group. if it is your family group, and they were likely enrolled, then you can search the oklahoma historical society’s dawes roll link to get the enrollment #’s for particular family members.
http://www.okhistory.org/research/dawes

if your family was enrolled by council action early in the process or was enrolled by lawsuit, they might not appear on the oklahoma historical society website. you would have to check with the tribe on that.

even if your family was rejected by the dawes process, you may want the testimony, census card, application information for your genealogical purposes.

the federal census will also help you decide which state to contact for vital records.

the dawes roll was taken 1896-1906, so you should trace your ancestors down to that time period. mostly, they had to be living in oklahoma by that time and agree to live there permanently.

history of the dawes roll
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawes_Act
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawes_Commission
wikipedia entries are sometimes opinionated; entered by volunteers.

helpful information about tribal enrollment
http://www.felihkatubbe.com/ChoctawNation/TribalMembership.html

freedmen information:
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ewyatt/_borders/
http://digital.library.okstate.edu/encyclopedia/entries/F/FR016.html
http://www.african-nativeamerican.com/8-chocfreed.htm
http://www.okhistory.org/research/dawes

2 ways to search:
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/finalroll.php
this will let you enter partial names to get card#. click on the card# in the card column and you can see other names in that family.
other resources on the left and at the bottom of this webpage. native census records and databases are especially useful.

http://www.okhistory.org/research/dawes/index.php
this will give you card# (family group) and enrollment #. they have some native marriage records too. other oklahoma records listed at left.
if your relative was enrolled by court action, their name might not be on this list.
if the name is common, you may find too many possible records.
you can order the dawes packet from the oklahoma historical society website.

if you find a relative listed on the dawes roll, fold3 may have filmed the record and could be available online.
http://www.fold3.com/documents/46580455/dawes-packets/
other resources are NARA http://www.archives.gov

the five civilized tribes book put out by the department of the interior has testimony.
http://books.google.com/books/about/Five_civilized_tribes_in_Oklahoma.html?id=chATAAAAYAAJ
and you can read it online

and these are the microfilms at fort worth TX archives.
http://www.archives.gov/southwest/finding-aids/native-american-microfilm.html

there may be additional records about your relative:
contact NARA http://www.archives.gov for these and other records listed on this webpage.

75.23 RECORDS OF THE COMMISSIONER TO THE FIVE CIVILIZED TRIBES 1852-1919
75.23.1 Records of the Dawes Commission
75.23.2 Records of the U.S. Indian Inspector for Indian Territory
75.23.3 General records of the Commissioner to the Five Civilized Tribes
http://www.archives.gov/research/guide-fed-records/groups/075.html
(Record Group 75)
1793-1989

http://okhistory.cuadra.com/star/public.html
oklahoma newspaper and archives search. some of these resources may be available through interlibrary loan/public library.
you can try school records in the oklahoma state archives, the oklahoma historical society and NARA.
http://www.odl.state.ok.us/oar/
http://www.okhistory.org/
these two resources might have historical newspapers and local history books. your public library/interlibrary loan program might also have access to newspapers and local history books.

http://www.archives.gov

as for stories, you can see if any of the relatives are mentioned in the oklahoma pioneer papers or oklahoma chronicles.

http://digital.libraries.ou.edu/whc/pioneer/
volumes are alphabetical by surname.
if an interview is not online, contact the host of these interviews.

http://www.okhistory.org/publications/chronicles

as for location for your family, you should look on the federal census 1900-1940 for your family and this will give you locations, family members. your local public library probably has a subscription to ancestry.com and heritage quest.

the tribe has an excellent information to help you. it is found under genealogy advocacy.
http://choctawnation.com/services/departments/community-services/
some obituaries:
http://www.choctawnation.com/history/obituaries/

NARA http://www.archives.gov/ federal records repository. the fort worth, TX office has archives for oklahoma and texas tribes. atlanta/morrow office has archives for the southeast tribes. many offices have microfilmed records for several tribes. note that this web address has changed recently from nara.gov.

freedmen info:
You can ONLY apply for Choctaw Nation Membership, AFTER you have obtained a CDIB card proving your Choctaw Blood lineage to a direct ancestor who actually enrolled, BY BLOOD. Freedmen DID NOT enroll By Blood. When US Congress closed the Final Dawes Commission Rolls, there were no provisions granting Freedmen any benefits after the Dawes Commission closed. The tribe Constitution states BY BLOOD. however, the documents (application, census card and testimony) may help you find out more about your heritage.

about blood quantum laws:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_quantum_laws
calculations about blood quantum:
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~wishawa4/Menominee%20Indians/quantum.htm

mississippi choctaw and choctaw tribe explained here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choctaw_Trail_of_Tears
http://www.choctaw.org/

jena choctaw tribe in louisiana:
http://www.jenachoctaw.org/

MOWA tribe
http://encyclopediaofalabama.org/face/Article.jsp?id=h-1368
http://www.uab.edu/uabmagazine/2009/july/losttribe
http://www.native-american-online.org/MOWA-Choctaw.htm
MOWA Band Of Choctaws Wilford Taylor 1080 Red Fox Road Mount Vernon, AL 36560 (251) 829-5500. E-Mail: chieftaylor@mowachoctaw.com

other choctaw tribes:
http://www.aaanativearts.com/choctaw-indians/index.html

chickasaw historical society
Historic Preservation and Repatriation Office
Phone: (580) 272-5325
Fax: (580) 272-5327
2020 E. Arlington, Suite 4, Ada, OK 74820
send mail to: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821

chickasaw tribe
Chickasaw Nation Headquarters
520 East Arlington, Ada, OK 74820
Phone (580) 436-2603
Mailing address: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821
http://www.chickasaw.net/index.htm

chickasaw genealogy archive center Tribal Library
Phone: (580) 310-6477
Fax: (580) 559-0773
1003 Chamber Loop, Ada, OK 74820
send mail to: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821

http://www.okhistory.org/
oklahoma historical society
marriage records
http://www.okhistory.org/research/library/marriage.html
http://www.okgenweb.org/~okgarvin/kinard/chocmarriageindex.htm

other historical societies:
http://www.daddezio.com/society/hill/SH-OK-NDX.html
some oklahoma genealogical societies:
http://www.censusfinder.com/oklahoma-genealogy-society.htm
http://www.geneasearch.com/societies/socokla.htm

texas tribes
http://www.native-languages.org/texas.htm
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/texas/index.htm
http://www.texasindians.com/
http://www.lsjunction.com/places/indians.htm

oklahoma tribes:
http://500nations.com/Oklahoma_Tribes.asp
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/oklahoma/index.htm
http://www.cowboy.net/native/tribes.html
http://yvwiiusdinvnohii.net/OKTribes.htm

tribes in other locations:
http://www.ncsl.org/issues-research/tribal/list-of-federal-and-state-recognized-tribes.aspx

some links for the choctaw.
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/tribes/choctaw/index.htm
i looked at the land records and those need a lot of work. i have no information about whether or when they will improve some of these categories.

types of records available for native americans:
pages 366-369 in particular although the entire native american chapter is helpful.
The Genealogist’s Companion and Sourcebook:
Guide to the Resources You Need for Unpuzzling Your Past
Emily Anne Croom
you can ask for these particular pages from your local public library. if they don’t have the book, you can get the pages through the interlibrary loan program.
native american records are discussed in pages 352-386.

Tracing ancestors among the Five Civilized Tribes: Southeastern Indians …
By Rachal Mills Lennon
this book could be accessed through the interlibary loan program also.

always find the state archives. some records are online, some records are not. but many times you can find a record not found in other places. you want to see also about newspaper mentions for obituaries, births, marriages in particular.

check courts for probate, civil and criminal cases, marriage records.

if your ancestors lived on a reservation, they might not appear on a federal census because they were not taxed.
http://www.okgenweb.org/~okgarvin/kinard/1860index.htm
1860 census, indian territory.

this book is a good read about the dawes roll and how they implemented it.
The Dawes Commission and the allotment of the Five Civilized Tribes, 1893-1914
By Kent Carter
and you can read this book online. your relatives’ testimony might be in the book.
http://www.archive.org/details/fivecivilizedtr00statgoog
see the menu at left. you can download it.
you should look at the enrollment application, census card and testimony. this post will tell you how to do that. these documents will tell you more about your heritage, but it won’t help you if your goal is to be enrolled in the choctaw tribe of oklahoma. some people were classed as mississippi choctaw if the family had a native heritage but didn’t qualify for enrollment in the tribe.

there are 63 tribes in oklahoma but only the five major tribes are on the dawes roll. look at your family’s location around 1900-1930 time period (census will help you there) and see if there was a tribe located nearby. it is possible that your relatives were affiliated with another tribe.

if they were mississippi choctaw, there is probably a land grant in MS/AL to a head of household called choctaw scrip land. this was given in lieu of tribal enrollment 1830-1880 time period. ancestry.com has a database of the MS and AL choctaw scrip land records, called mississippi or alabama land records. there are other land records in those databases too,, so you have to look at the authority/source cited. NARA http://www.archives.gov has those land record packages.

the mississippi choctaw were not removed from oklahoma. but they were largely rejected for tribal enrollment.

this website might help you in your search. some people are trying to transcribe applications.
http://www.us-census.org/native/choctaw_dawes.html
i do not know what they are trying to transcribe, but this is the volunteer page
http://www.us-census.org/states/graphics/status.htm

and this might be of interest to you:
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/choctaw/rights-of-choctaws.htm
Rights of Mississippi Choctaws in the Choctaw Nation

http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/finalrolls/
Index to the Final Rolls of the Citizens and Freedmen of the Five Civilized Tribes in Indian Territory
the dawes roll is composed of applications to the five major tribes in oklahoma.

good advice about native research:
http://jenniferhsrn2.homestead.com/research2.html

if your relatives came from a different geographic location or belonged to a different tribe, try searching google for the state and tribes. you might find a contact for a state-recognized tribe or a federal recognized tribe.

this page can help you set up a targeted google search.
http://www.searchforancestors.com/google/searcher.html

penny postcards. this is a website that features pictures that were on postcards. click on the state to see the postcards that they have.
http://www.usgwarchives.org/special/ppcs/ppcs.html
if you have a penny postcard, you can click on submissions to add your penny postcard to the collection.

these searches will combine several possible search terms and give you the best matches.

i have collected many resources over the years. if you want to write to me, shamlet76@gmail.com and request the choctaw resource list, i will be glad to send it to you.

i am just a volunteer that wants to empower people to learn how to do genealogy.

suzanne hamlet shatto

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on December 13, 2013

is this your relative?
1900 United States Federal Census about Thomas R Payne
Name: Thomas R Pane
[Payne]
Age: 13
Birth Date: abt 1887
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1900: Township 5, Choctaw Nation, Indian Territory
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Son
Father’s Name: James B Pane
Mother’s Name: Mary Pane
Occupation: View on Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
James B Payne 39
Mary Payne 40
Garland Bertice Payne 15
Leone Payne 14
Hurbert Payne 14
Thomas R Payne 13
Ethel M Payne
Peter Payne
Minnie Payne
Mable Payne
Source Citation: Year: 1900; Census Place: Township 5, Choctaw Nation, Indian Territory; Roll: 1853; Enumeration District: 0183; FHL microfilm: 1241853.

he was born in TN well after the trail of tears in the late 1830s. since his family came from TN, they were living off-reservation. people lived off-reservation because they did not want to live under the authority of a tribe.

only mable was born in indian territory. the rest of the family was born in tennessee. they rent a farm, so they were not given an allotment by 1900. james benjamin payne is a farmer.

1910 United States Federal Census about Thomas R Payne
Name: Thomas R Payne
[Tumar R Payne]
[User-submitted-comment]
Age in 1910: 22
Birth Year: abt 1888
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1910: Township 12, Bryan, Oklahoma
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Brother-in-law
Marital Status: Single
Father’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Mother’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Limon Phillips 28
Ethel Phillips 20
Mary A Phillips 0
[1/12]
Robert L Payne 44
Thomas R Payne 22

Source Citation: Year: 1910; Census Place: Township 12, Bryan, Oklahoma; Roll: T624_1244; Page: 12A; Enumeration District: 0033; FHL microfilm: 1375257

this family also rents a farm.

Tennessee State Marriages, 1780-2002 about J B Payne
Name: J B Payne
Spouse: Ellen Meeks
Marriage Date: 16 Aug 1881
Marriage County: Grundy

1880 United States Federal Census about James Payne
Name: James Payne
Age: 19
Birth Year: abt 1861
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1880: District 7, Grundy, Tennessee
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Son
Marital Status: Single
Father’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Mother’s Name: Elizabeth Payne
Mother’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Neighbors: View others on page
Cannot read/write:

Blind:

Deaf and dumb:

Otherwise disabled:

Idiotic or insane:

View Image
Household Members:
Name Age
Elizabeth Payne 53
George Payne 27
James Payne 19
J. F. Payne 16
Micaja Payne 15
Robert Payne 14
Wm. E. Payne 11
Source Citation: Year: 1880; Census Place: District 7, Grundy, Tennessee; Roll: 1258; Family History Film: 1255258; Page: 312D; Enumeration District: 044.

this family was living off-reservation in 1880 and they were not on the native census records.

1910 United States Federal Census about Mary E Payne
Name: Mary E Payne
Age in 1910: 50
Birth Year: abt 1860
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1910: Township 12, Bryan, Oklahoma
Race: White
Gender: Female
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Widowed
Father’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Mother’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary E Payne 50
Herbert W Payne 24
Peter Payne 17
Minnie Payne 15
Mabel Payne 10
Source Citation: Year: 1910; Census Place: Township 12, Bryan, Oklahoma; Roll: T624_1244; Page: 13A; Enumeration District: 0033; FHL microfilm: 1375257.

the family is renting a farm. so they were not accepted as a member of the tribe.

sorry.
http://500nations.com/Tennessee_Tribes.asp
http://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Indians_of_Tennessee
a caution: http://www.moccasinbend.net/cita/TNNAorgs.html

http://www.grundycountyhs.org/
they are putting on a program about native tribal affiliation.
April 22, 2014 – Pauline Brown
“Relatives of Shabbona and Genealogy of Indians”

suzanne hamlet shatto

Christopher Tiffany Christopher Tiffany

posted on December 13, 2013

Thank you very much! Yes that is him. The info you provided about birth dates, spouses, places match the info I have on hand. I guess his uncle Jerome F.Payne born March 1863, was registered TWP#1WB10e0 or at least that is what it says on the paperwork…a quick question:why does it say Race: WHITE? Am I missing something obvius?

Christopher Tiffany Christopher Tiffany

posted on December 13, 2013

Thank you very much! Yes that is him. The info you provided about birth dates, spouses, places match the info I have on hand. I guess his uncle Jerome F.Payne born March 1863, was registered TWP#1WB10e0 or at least that is what it says on the paperwork…a quick question:why does it say Race: WHITE? Am I missing something obvius?

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on December 13, 2013

what paperwork? what document are you referring to? tell me the title or something.

you give a date but no place, no date of death, no spouse, no children.

many consider natives as caucasians, so this is not unusual.

TWP is not a registration #. it stands for township. it is a location marker. i have no idea what 1WB10E0 means.

i see no jerome paynes on the dawes roll. there are two choctaw j payne listings but i don’t know who jerome was married to nor who his children are.

look here to see if your family names applied for enrollment. if you find a prospective name, click on the # in the card column and see the family group. that should match with the 1900 census record pretty closely. p=parent
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/final-rolls.htm

the dawes roll taken 1896-1906 in indian territory/oklahoma contains the names of applicants to the five major tribes. if you see a name of a relative, you can get a copy of the dawes packet from fold3.com, oklahoma historical society or NARA. see the links in the first reply for that.

i understand. you need to learn the native terms. in order to do that, you have to describe what you see so that someone can explain what it might mean.

suzanne hamlet shatto

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on December 13, 2013

1900 United States Federal Census about Jerome Payne
Name: Jerome Payne
Age: 37
Birth Date: abt 1863
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1900: Coalgate, Choctaw Nation, Indian Territory
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse’s Name: Mary C Payne
Occupation: View on Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jerome Payne 37
Mary C Payne 41
Mabel Payne 14
Homer Payne 12
Edward Payne 4
Source Citation: Year: 1900; Census Place: Coalgate, Choctaw Nation, Indian Territory; Roll: 1852; Enumeration District: 0104; FHL microfilm: 1241852.

this shows that jerome’s wife was mary, they were living in oklahoma/indian territory in 1900.
this family are listed as owning a home. youngest son born in TX but the rest of the family was born in TN.
jerome is a coal miner.

Tennessee State Marriages, 1780-2002 about J F Fayne
Name: J F Fayne
Spouse: Mary C Smith
Marriage Date: 20 Sep 1884
Marriage County: Coffee

1880 United States Federal Census about J. F. Payne
Name: J. F. Payne
[Jerome Franklin Payne]
Age: 16
Birth Year: abt 1864
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1880: District 7, Grundy, Tennessee
Race: White
Gender: Male
Father’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Mother’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Neighbors: View others on page
Cannot read/write:

Blind:

Deaf and dumb:

Otherwise disabled:

Idiotic or insane:

View Image
Household Members:
Name Age
Elizabeth Payne 53
George Payne 27
James Payne 19
J. F. Payne 16
Micaja Payne 15
Robert Payne 14
Wm. E. Payne 11
Source Citation: Year: 1880; Census Place: District 7, Grundy, Tennessee; Roll: 1258; Family History Film: 1255258; Page: 312D; Enumeration District: 044.

1910 United States Federal Census about Jerome F Payne
Name: Jerome F Payne
[Jerom F Beyne]
Age in 1910: 47
Birth Year: abt 1863
Birthplace: Tennessee
Home in 1910: Caddo Mills, Hunt, Texas
Race: White
Gender: Male
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Married
Spouse’s Name: Mary C Payne
Father’s Birthplace: North Carolina
Mother’s Birthplace: Tennessee
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jerome F Payne 47
Mary C Payne 52
Edward R Payne 14
Source Citation: Year: 1910; Census Place: Caddo Mills, Hunt, Texas; Roll: T624_1566; Page: 8B; Enumeration District: 0123; FHL microfilm: 1375579.

these people did not stay in oklahoma. it is doubtful that they applied for enrollment in an oklahoma tribe when they didn’t live under tribal authority. it doesn’t appear that they qualified for enrollment because they would have had difficulty submitting proof of native affiliation, since they lived in TN.

Christopher Tiffany Christopher Tiffany

posted on December 13, 2013

Sorry about the confusion! I have attached a jpg of the paperwork I have given to me by my aunt….
.

attached:

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on December 13, 2013

no, the picture link does not work. the choctaw tribe needs to fix this. i am not connected with the choctaw tribe. i cannot fix this.

Page Not Found

The page you were looking for could not be located on this site.

so i still don’t have the information that i requested.

residence does not confer citizenship in a tribe. there were business opportunities and oklahoma land rushes drawing people to the territory.

suzanne hamlet shatto

Christopher Tiffany Christopher Tiffany

posted on December 13, 2013

Thank you!