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Monds

Beverley Beverley

posted on October 17, 2011

I’m trying to find info on Job Rogers Monds (1784-1859) and wife, Mildred ? (1814-) . These are my great great grandparents and are reportedly of Choctaw descent. One of their daughters, Mary Jane Monds Tully is buried at Choctaw Nation, Pontotoc, OK. I am wondering if there were married on an Indian Reservation and if Mildred’s maiden name can be found. Some speculation is given that her name was Ridge. My family has exhausted all ancestry.com leads.
Thanks for any help.

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on October 17, 2011

if one of the children tried to enroll, there might be information in the enrollment packet or in the testimony.

is monds a married name for mary jane?
Dawes Card Information

tribe last first middle age sex blood card roll misc type
Choctaw Monds Mary J 0 F 4344 P
Choctaw Monds Sam 0 M 4344 P
Choctaw Zanola Bytrice 0 F 4344 P
Choctaw Zanola Joe 0 M 4344 P
Choctaw Zanola Noah 1 M 1/16 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola Wavely 1 F 1/16 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola Hester 2 F 1/16 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola Annie 4 F 1/16 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola Augestine 5 M 1/16 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola Mildred 22 F 1/8 4344 NR COALGATE BB
Choctaw Zanola John 49 M IW 4344 NR COALGATE BB
p=parent
iw=intermarried white, a general nontribal description.

no children, no spouse,, no dates,, no location for mary jane monds tully. genealogists use this information to match records.

are they on federal census records? or the native census and database records? you can look for the native records on the accessgenealogy website, see the left menu. natives were listed in the 10 year federal census records if they were living off-reservation and taxed. if they were living on reservation, they were not taxed and not on the federal census. in that case they would be in the native census records and databases.

have you written to anyone who posted about your family on rootsweb.com and ancestry.com?
have you checked with the state archives?
how about the state historical society?

this is quite early, if the native went on the trail of tears:
Arkansas Census, 1819-70 about Job R. Monds
Name: Job R. Monds
State: AR
County: Washington County
Township: No Township Listed
Year: 1836
Record Type: Tax list
Page: 025
Database: AR 1830-1839 Tax Lists Index

try the land records too:
Ancestry.com. U.S. General Land Office Records, 1796-1907 [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2008.
Original data: United States. Bureau of Land Management, General Land Office Records. Automated Records Project; Federal Land Patents, State Volumes. http://www.glorecords.blm.gov/ Springfield, Virginia: Bureau of Land Management, Eastern States, 2007.

Missouri Census, 1830-70 about Job Monds
Name: Job Monds
State: MO
County: Greene County
Township: No Township Listed-Tax
Year: 1833
Database: MO 1830-1839 Census Index

War of 1812 Service Records about Job Monds
Name: Job Monds
Company: 1 REG’T (WEAR’S) EAST TENNESSEE VOLS.
Rank – Induction: PRIVATE
Rank – Discharge: PRIVATE
Roll Box: 146
Roll Exct: 602

Tennessee Marriages to 1825 about Job R. Sarah Monday Smith
Spouse 1: Monday, Job R.
Spouse 2: Smith, Sarah
Marriage Date: 1 Oct 1814
Marriage Location: Tennessee
Knox County

Arkansas Land Records about Job R Monds
Name: Job R Monds
Warrantee Name: Job Monds
Land Office: ARKANSAS
Document Number: 23103
Total Acres: 160
Signature: Yes
Canceled Document: No
Issue Date: 27 Nov 1820
Mineral Rights Reserved: No
Metes and Bounds: No
Statutory Reference: 2 Stat 728
Multiple Warantee Names: No
Act or Treaty: May 6, 1812
Multiple Patentee Names: No
Entry Classification: Script Warrant Act of of 1812
Land Description:
1 SE 5TH PM No 1S 6W 9

this would have been given before the trail of tears, 1820.

so they were in TN in 1812 (when he went to the war of 1812), TN in 1814 when they were married. in 1820 they were in AR.

and the treaty of rabbit creek was later than that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Dancing_Rabbit_Creek

Arkansas Census, 1819-70 about Job Monds
Name: Job Monds
State: AR
County: Crawford County
Township: Tax List 1821
Year: 1821
Record Type: Tax List
Page: 004
Database: AR 1819-1829 Tax Lists Index

possibly mildred might be a second wife?
do you have her cemetery record? death record? obituary from a historical newspaper?
you might contact arkansas state archives, arkansas vital records and arkansas historical society for this.

mildred might have been born in kentucky, by the 1850 census record.

Missouri Census, 1830-70 about Job Monds
Name: Job Monds
State: MO
County: Greene County
Township: No Township Listed-Tax
Year: 1833
Database: MO 1830-1839 Census Index

Arkansas Census, 1819-70 about Job R. Monds
Name: Job R. Monds
State: AR
County: Washington County
Township: No Township Listed
Year: 1836
Record Type: Tax list
Page: 025
Database: AR 1830-1839 Tax Lists Index

did you look at a map of the area? proximity might tell you something.
the family might be mentioned in newspaper articles. see your local public library for the interlibrary loan program.

i see that maris52000 has indicated that they know of your family’s native heritage. have you tried corresponding with them?

on the personal stories/newspaper tab, there is a text file called The Mystery of the Munn/ Muns/ Monds Name but i couldn’t open it. might be a temporary glitch with ancestry.com.

unfortunately, sometimes maiden names were not researched many years ago. so some documents don’t exist. i would start from the death and work backwards.

genealogists use names, dates, locations, children and spouses to match records. if you have a common surname, you need to give more information rather than less. if you post about women, it is helpful to include the maiden name and the married name and designate which one is the maiden name.

start with what you know, gather documentation, then you can go backward in time. so get your birth certificate, your parents’ birth certificates and marriage license and then you can start on your grandparents. if someone passed away after 1/1/1937, they probably have a social security application on file. if you ask a government agency for a birth certificate, and they were born before 1929, they might have submitted a delayed birth certificate. death certificates, cemetery information and obituaries are helpful. you can usually get a copy of an obituary, newspaper mentions such as birth of a child or marriage, through the interlibrary loan program – see your local public library for this. i usually start with the death and work toward the person’s birth. military records and pension records can be helpful. census records can tell you where they were at particular times, names of family members. the census records up to 1930 are available, although the 1890 census was largely destroyed. the 1940 census will be public information in 2012.

social security application for a deceased person:
http://www.ssa.gov/foia/html/foia_guide.htm

first of all, heritage and tribal enrollment are two different things. many times natives didn’t apply for enrollment because 1) they didn’t qualify, 2) they were philosophically opposed to enrollment, 3) they didn’t have documentation, or 4) they were mississippi choctaw and their ancestor had accepted land or benefits in lieu of tribal enrollment.

the dawes roll was taken 1896-1906, so you should trace your ancestors down to that time period. mostly, they had to be living in oklahoma by that time and agree to live there permanently.

history of the dawes roll
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawes_Act
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawes_Commission
wikipedia entries are sometimes opinionated; entered by volunteers.

helpful information about tribal enrollment
http://www.felihkatubbe.com/ChoctawNation/TribalMembership.html

2 ways to search:
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/finalroll.php
this will let you enter partial names to get card#. click on the card# in the card column and you can see other names in that family.
other resources on the left and at the bottom of this webpage. native census records and databases are especially useful.

http://www.okhistory.org/research/dawes/index.php
this will give you card# (family group) and enrollment #. they have some native marriage records too. other oklahoma records listed at left.
if the name is common, you may find too many possible records.
you can order the dawes packet from the oklahoma historical society website.

if you find a relative listed on the dawes roll, fold3 may have filmed the record and could be available online.
http://www.fold3.com/documents/46580455/dawes-packets/
other resources are NARA http://www.archives.gov

http://okhistory.cuadra.com/star/public.html
oklahoma newspaper and archives search. some of these resources may be available through interlibrary loan/public library.

the tribe has an excellent information to help you. it is found under genealogy advocacy.
http://choctawnation.com/services/departments/community-services/

NARA http://www.archives.gov/ federal records repository. the fort worth, TX office has archives for oklahoma and texas tribes. atlanta/morrow office has archives for the southwest tribes. many offices have microfilmed records for several tribes. note that this web address has changed recently from nara.gov.

freedmen info:
You can ONLY apply for Choctaw Nation Membership, AFTER you have obtained a CDIB card proving your Choctaw Blood lineage to a direct ancestor who actually enrolled, BY BLOOD. Freedmen DID NOT enroll By Blood. When US Congress closed the Final Dawes Commission Rolls, there were no provisions granting Freedmen any benefits after the Dawes Commission closed. The tribe Constitution states BY BLOOD. however, the documents (application, census card and testimony) may help you find out more about your heritage.

mississippi choctaw and choctaw tribe explained here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choctaw_Trail_of_Tears
http://www.choctaw.org/

jena choctaw tribe in louisiana:
http://www.jenachoctaw.org/

MOWA tribe
http://encyclopediaofalabama.org/face/Article.jsp?id=h-1368
http://www.uab.edu/uabmagazine/2009/july/losttribe
http://www.native-american-online.org/MOWA-Choctaw.htm
MOWA Band Of Choctaws Wilford Taylor 1080 Red Fox Road Mount Vernon, AL 36560 (251) 829-5500. E-Mail: chieftaylor@mowachoctaw.com

other choctaw tribes:
http://www.aaanativearts.com/choctaw-indians/index.html

chickasaw historical society
Historic Preservation and Repatriation Office
Phone: (580) 272-5325
Fax: (580) 272-5327
2020 E. Arlington, Suite 4, Ada, OK 74820
send mail to: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821

chickasaw tribe
Chickasaw Nation Headquarters
520 East Arlington, Ada, OK 74820
Phone (580) 436-2603
Mailing address: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821
http://www.chickasaw.net/index.htm

chickasaw genealogy archive center Tribal Library
Phone: (580) 310-6477
Fax: (580) 559-0773
1003 Chamber Loop, Ada, OK 74820
send mail to: P.O. Box 1548, Ada, OK 74821

http://www.okhistory.org/
oklahoma historical society
other historical societies:
http://www.daddezio.com/society/hill/SH-OK-NDX.html
some oklahoma genealogical societies:
http://www.censusfinder.com/oklahoma-genealogy-society.htm
http://www.geneasearch.com/societies/socokla.htm

texas tribes
http://www.native-languages.org/texas.htm
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/texas/index.htm
http://www.texasindians.com/
http://www.texasindians.com/
http://www.lsjunction.com/places/indians.htm

oklahoma tribes:
http://500nations.com/Oklahoma_Tribes.asp
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/oklahoma/index.htm
http://www.cowboy.net/native/tribes.html

some links for the choctaw.
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/tribes/choctaw/index.htm
i looked at the land records and those need a lot of work. i have no information about whether or when they will improve some of these categories.

types of records available for native americans:
pages 366-369 in particular although the entire native american chapter is helpful.
The Genealogist’s Companion and Sourcebook:
Guide to the Resources You Need for Unpuzzling Your Past
Emily Anne Croom
you can ask for these particular pages from your local public library. if they don’t have the book, you can get the pages through the interlibrary loan program.
native american records are discussed in pages 352-386.

Tracing ancestors among the Five Civilized Tribes: Southeastern Indians …
By Rachal Mills Lennon
this book could be accessed through the interlibary loan program also.

always find the state archives. some records are online, some records are not. but many times you can find a record not found in other places. you want to see also about newspaper mentions for obituaries, births, marriages in particular.

check courts for probate, civil and criminal cases, marriage records.

if your ancestors lived on a reservation, they might not appear on a federal census because they were not taxed.
http://www.okgenweb.org/~okgarvin/kinard/1860index.htm
1860 census, indian territory.

this book is a good read about the dawes roll and how they implemented it.
The Dawes Commission and the allotment of the Five Civilized Tribes, 1893-1914
By Kent Carter

good advice about native research:
http://jenniferhsrn2.homestead.com/research2.html

if your relatives came from a different geographic location or belonged to a different tribe, try searching google for the state and tribes. you might find a contact for a state-recognized tribe or a federal recognized tribe.

this page can help you set up a targeted google search.
http://www.searchforancestors.com/google/searcher.html

these searches will combine several possible search terms and give you the best matches.

i have collected many resources over the years. if you want to write to me, shamlet76@gmail.com and request the choctaw resource list, i will be glad to send it to you.

i am just a volunteer that wants to empower people to learn how to do genealogy.

suzanne hamlet shatto

Beverley Beverley

posted on October 18, 2011 and updated on October 18, 2011

Thanks for all the info, Suzanne. I have been looking at all the websites you listed. I have some obvious confusion. Sam was my gggrandmother’s brother. Sam’s wife, Mary J was Indian. His son was Richard and all the other Monds listed were Richard’s children. They have roll number 4344. Sam is my direct descendant and listed on the roll, can you tell by this if he is listed by marriage or by blood? When I go to the national archives site and look on the dawes list they are not there. This family is MONDS (father Job (Jacob) and mother Mildred). Supposedly Mildred’s maiden name was Ridge and she was a daughter of John Ridge, however I do not find her listed anywhere as a child of John’s. Any suggestions?

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on October 18, 2011

it is not uncommon to find that names run in families. but you have to be sure you are collecting documents on the correct person. but, because so many names are the same, you should gather documents.

it appears that mary j., sam’s wife, was 1/4 choctaw, if she was the only native.

it doesn’t sound like sam was your direct descendant, if his sister was your ancestor. but information for him would be the same as information for his sister, so it might pertain.

sam and mary j. monds were parents of mildred. mildred would have to give information about her heritage, which would refer to her parents, and maybe her grandparents.

you should request a copy of that family’s dawes packet, which would include census card and enrollment application. you might also get some information about testimony.

i have no suggestions about how to find this information other than looking for a marriage license, a cemetery record, an obituary, a will, a child’s birth record.

were any of her children alive 1/1/1937, when social security came into effect? they would have filled out a social security application and submitted a birth record. often this is a delayed birth certificate from the state where they were born.

state archives often have old vital records, while state vital records office and county offices have other vital records. often state historical societies or state archives have historical newspapers and you might be able to access some of them through interlibrary loan/your local public library.

cemetery records could be on interment.com or findagrave.com. some of the family trees might indicate a place of death and/or place of burial.

if ancestry has the wrong spelling for the name in records, you can enter an alternate name, so that others can find your family. but be aware you might be able to find records by checking all possible spellings.

gl.

Beverley Beverley

posted on October 19, 2011

Suzanne
Mildred Zanola (Sam and Mary Jane Mond’s daugher) card roll #4344 lists BB. She was born 9/23/1877 and died 3/15/1948. Would I be able to request her Dawe’s packet from the national archives? I’m not too far from a facility and can go there if need be. Would that packet tell me if Sam was indeed Indian? Then I would be able to find the mystery of his sister, Amanda, who is my direct ancester. On the 1910 Federal Census she is listed as American Indian. Now I do know that her mother Mary J was Indian but don’t know about father Sam.
Thanks

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on October 19, 2011

BB=by blood
you can request a copy of her enrollment packet, which would include information on the rest of the family. the dawes enrollment packages are a matter of public record, not private. however tribal enrollments are private generally. so if you want enrollment documents from someone who was enrolled later and not on the dawes roll, you would not qualify to get those. the tribe would have those private enrollment applications.

it would probably tell you if sam was native or whether he was choctaw.
yes, i think you should pursue it in this manner, because it might resolve the question about sam monds.

On the 1910 Federal Census she is listed as American Indian.
who is this “she”?
mildred zanola?
amanda or someone else.
or mary jane monds tully?
is the sister really amanda monds tully? i didn’t try to look for that name. sometimes people misremember, but this is one of the reasons i encourage people to get family tree software and keep file folders on families and research logs.
http://www.legacyfamilytree.com/
this is free software.

and you can upload a family tree free to rootsweb.com so that you can share your family tree with others.

i am confused about the names now.
where is “she” on the 1910 federal census?

there is information that is not in your post. genealogists use name, location, children and spouse to match records. i don’t know the name of the person i am looking for, the spouse’s name, the childrens’ names, the location where i should look. and now i have one year where she appears but nothing else: 1910.

Beverley Beverley

posted on October 23, 2011

Suzanne-
On the 1910 Census Mildred Zanola is listed as Am Indian. She was Sam Monds daughter. Sam’s wife was Mary Jane James and she was reportedly Indian. Sam Monds was brother to Mary Jane Monds (married Tully) and Amanda Monds (married Davis). Amanda is my direct link. Amanda, Sam and Mary Jane appear only in the 1850 Census spelled Mounds. Their parents were Job (Jacob) Roger Monds (Mounds) and Mildred (?). Family historians say that Mildred was full Cherokee and suspected her maiden name was Ridge, daughter of Major Ridge. But as I earlier stated I can not find proof anywhere that he had a daugther by that name. It appears that Sam’s children Mildred and her brother Richard are the only ones who actually signed up on the Dawes. Mary Jane Tully died on her way to sign.
I do see on the Choctaw Roll that Mildred Zanola is listed as 1/8. I know that Mary Jane James (Sam’s wife) was Indian via ancestry.com info. My quest is to find out if Sam was indeed listed anywhere as Indian so that we can resolve the issue simualtaneously with his sister Amanda (although I realize she is not documented anywhere).
I hope this clears some issues up. You have been most helpful to me.
Thanks
Beverley

suzanne hamlet shatto suzanne hamlet shatto

posted on October 24, 2011

you will have to see the dawes packet to see what was claimed, what was proven.

Texas Marriage Collection, 1814-1909 and 1966-2002 about Amanda Mounds
Name: Amanda Mounds
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 6 Jun 1862

Spouse: George W. Davis

Marriage City: Cooke
Marriage State: Texas

Source: Texas Marriages, 1851-1900

the trail of tears did not go through texas, but several unofficial migrations did. this might be the source of some problem for your family.

my advice is to see whether there are any texas tribes near the location of your family.

is this the record that you are talking about?
Texas Marriage Collection, 1814-1909 and 1966-2002 about Amanda Mounds
Name: Amanda Mounds
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 6 Jun 1862

Spouse: George W. Davis

Marriage City: Cooke
Marriage State: Texas

Source: Texas Marriages, 1851-1900
Source Citation: Year: 1850; Census Place: Osage, Benton, Arkansas; Roll: M432_25; Page: 74A; Image: 149.

but i am not able to get the census records based on the information that you have provided.

you need to look at the treaty of rabbit creek and the mississippi choctaw links in the first post. this might explain more about the membership requirements for the tribe.

bands of natives tended to move together, as a group. they tended to settle together.

Linda Freeman Linda Freeman

posted on February 2, 2012

Maude Elizabeth Nelson married Morris Craft Tully. Morris is 1/32 Cherokee on the Final Dawes Rolls. His father, John D. Tully is listed as 1/16 Cherokee but for some reason it appears he was denied by the Dawes Commission on 13 Jan 1906.
Dawes Card Information

tribe last first middle age sex blood card roll misc type
Cherokee Tully John D 0 M 10993 P
Cherokee Tully Manera A 0 F 10993 P (Manerva Ann Craft – White)
Cherokee Tully Morris C 5 M 1/32 10993 32890 GRITTS BB
2/1/2012
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/dawescard.php?s_surname=Tully&s_first=&s_roll=32890&s_tribe=Cherokee&s_card=10993

Look at this site also for Tully
http://narademo.umiacs.umd.edu/cgi-bin/isadg/viewobject.pl?object=96627&tab=2

I found this at Ancestry.com on your Monds family.
The Mystery of the Munn/ Muns/ Monds Name1700-1900 , IL, MO, OH, NC, AR

Margaret Catherine MUNN was born about 1847 (according to the US Census) to Joseph MUNN and Elizabeth (family Bible record says Jones or James and Ancestry says Aimes as her maiden name). Joseph MUNN and Elizabeth also have children named: Elizabeth 1832, Alexander H. 1837, George W. 1839, Mahala 1843, Nancy 1849 and Amanda.

Margaret Catherine MUNN marries James F. Twigg on February 9, 1869. Their children are Julia Catherine “Katie” Twigg, Willy Twigg and Elexander (Alexander) Twigg.

Nancy MUNN married Noah KNIGHT and then later marries Shadrach SMITH.

Julia Catherine “Katie” Twigg married Silas B. Monds (MUNS). They have two children: Dona Belle Monds (MUNS) and Charles Franklin Monds (MUNS). The spelling was changed with Silas H.B. Monds for reasons unknown- his Father’s name was John Columbus MUNS. Julia “Katie” and Silas both die by 1920 and Charles and Dona Belle are sent to live with their paternal Grandfather John C. MUNS until John C. dies and then Charles is sent to live with his great Aunt Nancy SMITH who at that time was married to Shadrach Smith. Dona Belle was sent to foster homes for reasons unknown.

John Columbus MUNS is believed to be the son of Job Roger MUNS b.1793 also known as Jacob who was married to Sarah SMITH b. 1797 origin unknown.

Joseph MUNN is the son of James Frances MUNN b. 1763 in England.

SUBMITTED BY:

Ashley A. (Wilson) – Wife of David M. SCOTT who is the son of Linda SCOTT who is the daughter of Sandra SCOTT who is the grand daughter of Pearl L. MONDS who is the daughter of Charles Franklin MONDS and Effie HENRY.

Maude Elizabeth Nelson is the daughter of Lillie/Lily Bivens “Bivie” Freeman and William Thomas Nelson of Oklahoma and Texas. Lily is the sister of Jasper Newton Freeman, Sr. and Mariah Jane McCasson. Mariah Jane is the daughter of Samuel H. McCasson and Eliza J. Morris; all are Choctaw.

My email address is lindagf@cmaaccess.com. The Tully/Monds connections are all new to me, I just found them today.

Linda Freeman